02:01:29 <Isthmus> 17:50 <needmoney90> Or is O() being used as shorthand for 'on the order of'? < yeah I’ve seen/used it that way before.
02:02:10 <Isthmus> I usually interpret it as complexity if there’s an N inside, and interpret it as “roughly order of” in there’s units :- P
03:14:00 <sarang> needmoney90: it's a convenient misuse of notation
03:14:13 <sarang> sorry for any confusion
03:14:22 <sarang> read that as "on the order of..."
03:15:22 <needmoney90> At least I'm not going crazy
03:16:15 <sarang> Nope :D
07:18:49 <midipoet> https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/0268396220944406
11:59:29 <fluffypony> ok who's going to spend the $37.50 so we can all read that
11:59:29 <fluffypony> :-P
12:06:04 <midipoet> i can't believe my work is valued so cheaply :p
12:06:11 <midipoet> that took years!
12:20:42 <fluffypony> who does the $37.50 even go to
12:22:22 <midipoet> the publishers only
12:22:57 <fluffypony> meanies
12:23:57 <midipoet> i guess they view that author's gain reputational/professional compensation in kind
12:31:41 <moneromooo> They view that if you take some numbers here and put them there instead, it looks like they end up better off. So they quickly learn to put numbers there. Simple as that.
12:33:02 <moneromooo> We're wired for that. Us first (except after you have children). Then family. Then friends. Since a few thousand years, people born inside the same imaginary lines on a map. After first contact, earthlings.
12:34:05 * moneromooo sees the channel and shuts up
13:36:23 <zkao> adding sci-hub.tw in front of pay-walled links to scientific papers is the way to go, but generally authors have the right to publish their own work on their websites
13:42:21 <sarang> midipoet: congrats on the publication!
13:42:45 <sarang> Is there a preprint version available?
14:03:32 <midipoet> yeah. i guess so. but if i am honest, i know there were some last copy-editing issues between the print and preprint, so wanted to tidy them up
14:04:40 <sarang> ah ok
14:04:57 <sarang> I ask because that way the preprint version could presumably be distributed publicly and freely
14:05:12 <sarang> (please do not use this channel to advocate for, or enable, copyright infringement)
14:05:35 <jwinterm> zkao is correct that generally authors are allowed to host their publications on a personal website
14:05:48 <sarang> Probably depends on the journal's distribution and copyright agreement
14:05:59 <sarang> I've seen that on journals to which I've submitted
14:06:28 <jwinterm> I know that's the case for applied physics letters/AIP
14:06:46 <sarang> Yeah, and often specific exceptions for preprint servers too, like arXiv
14:08:00 <sarang> At any rate, having a preprint to link publicly would be great :D
14:08:02 <jwinterm> May I post my article online or otherwise distribute it without permission from SAGE?
14:08:02 <jwinterm> Yes, please visit our Guidelines for SAGE Authors to review how, as an author, you may share your Contribution.
14:08:19 <jwinterm> there is full info here: https://us.sagepub.com/en-us/nam/journal-author-archiving-policies-and-re-use
14:08:49 <jwinterm> You may share the Original Submission or Accepted Manuscript at any time after your paper is accepted and in any format. Your sharing of the Original Submission or Accepted Manuscript may include posting a downloadable copy on any website, saving a copy in any repository or network, sharing a copy through any social media channel, and distributing print or electronic copies.
14:09:44 * moneromooo takes back the earlier sarcasm, that's pretty fair
14:10:48 <sarang> Ah ok, so you can't distribute the final journal-formatted copy that they prepare
14:10:54 <sarang> but you can distribute the version you sent them
14:11:17 <jwinterm> right, or the corrected version after editorial review
14:11:22 <jwinterm> just not their pdf basically
14:11:50 <sarang> midipoet: go for it!
14:13:03 <midipoet> jwinterm: to be fair, in the email they sent to me it words things differently.
14:13:25 <sarang> How so?
14:14:15 <midipoet> oh maybe it is the same
14:14:20 <midipoet> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/76eQ4wmq/Screenshot%202020-08-28%20at%2015.13.38.png
14:14:37 <sarang> That's consistent
14:14:42 <sarang> Accepted version: yes
14:14:46 <sarang> Published version: no
14:14:53 <midipoet> it doesn't say sharing though. just hosting
14:15:00 <midipoet> but i suppose that is maybe one and the same
14:15:17 <sarang> Well, I'd go with the official policy on their website, if it were me
14:15:20 <sarang> and that email seems consistent
14:15:35 <sarang> They seem to differentiate between individual sharing for research purposes, and making publicly available
14:16:03 <jwinterm> generally you are also allowed to share the final journal pdf on an individual basis also, just not mass distribution
14:16:13 <sarang> Yeah, and that's in the policy too
14:16:16 <jwinterm> this is why researchgate allows you to bother people to send you their articles
14:16:32 <sarang> Journals are pretty chill about sharing with your colleagues for research purposes, as long as it isn't en masse
14:16:40 <jwinterm> right
14:16:45 <jwinterm> I dunno about chill
14:16:50 <midipoet> lol
14:16:54 <sarang> "apparently chill"
14:17:13 <jwinterm> probably abiding by some legal mumbo jumbo about fair use of intellectual property or something
14:17:15 <jwinterm> but yea
14:17:18 <moneromooo> Better than being chilling.
14:17:25 <sarang> oooh, burn
14:17:27 <sarang> chill burn
14:17:49 <moneromooo> Better than chilli burn.
14:17:55 * moneromooo looks for the door
14:17:56 <sarang> -____-
14:18:15 <sarang> If the knob is hot to the touch, don't use that door
17:54:28 <Isthmus> Remember that knaccc trick to replace the random mask with a deterministic one? Is that documented somewhere in ZtM2 (or elsewhere)?
17:56:25 <sarang> https://web.getmonero.org/library/Zero-to-Monero-2-0-0.pdf
17:56:43 <sarang> PDF page 61 (page 53 printed on the page headers)
17:57:15 <Isthmus> ty
18:11:52 <sarang> If anyone is interested, I'd appreciate proofreading of the ESORICS CBT workshop version of the Triptych paper: https://www.overleaf.com/read/zvzmgmpnppmq
18:12:16 <sarang> This is the version that will be submitted for publication after the workshop; it's been reformatted with minor changes to assure proper formatting
18:12:33 <sarang> Ten sarangpoints to anyone to finds a typo or other error!
18:13:00 <sarang> And yes, there's a TeX warning about float placement, which was introduced to adhere to the 18-page limit
18:13:10 <sarang> (because for some reason, digital journals require huge margins and page limits...)
18:13:27 <sarang> s/to finds/who finds
18:13:27 <monerobux> sarang meant to say: Ten sarangpoints to anyone who finds a typo or other error!
18:13:32 <sarang> ^ that typo does not count =p
18:14:15 <sarang> Classic TeX... margin overrun? Add or remove words to convince it to line up properly...