18:11:08 Where in the Monero protocol are ZKPs used? It’s the range proofs, correct? 18:12:21 That is my understanding 18:13:13 Thanks, I was like 95% sure but couldn’t find a source 18:13:49 Someone’s throwing the “ZKPs ARE THE FUTURE” at me and I wanted to remind them that Monero used ZKPs already and the term is vague and doesn’t refer to any whole privacy protocol 😜 18:14:05 Yeah since what, april 2017 or something like that 18:14:20 Yeah bulletproofs are a zkp 18:14:32 sarang is regularly frustrated by peoples understanding of zkp's 18:14:36 Colloquially though, zkp doesn't refer to our usage 18:15:21 still, monero protocol uses zero-knowledge proofs to prove that you are spending the correct number of coins - without revealing the number of coins to anyone else. 18:15:47 * Inge- looks over his shoulder, on the lookout for MRL researchers out to correct him 18:20:55 This was also my understanding; that monero uses a zero knowledge range proof. Maybe the guys you were speaking with were referring to Zero Knowledge argument systems like zk-snarks ? You could probably fit most of your transaction checking logic inside of a zk-snark 18:21:41 you could, but it would be larger and slower 18:22:12 It wouldn't be possible with Monero currently as IIRC, it uses bulletproofs rangeproofs which is only capable of proving a number is within a certain range without revealing that number 18:22:21 and of course, using zk-snark would require a trusted setup 18:23:29 Hmm, I think it depends on your definition of zk-snark. Some have efficient verification procedures and constant or small proofs sizes relative the statement being proven 18:25:05 Yeah most require a trusted setup, I think Spartan was the first zk-snark which did not require a trusted setup 18:25:06 if any such were suitable for the use case of "hide sender, receiver, and txn amount" then I imagine zcashwould have already used it. 18:25:32 as it is, they are still larger/slower, so pretty sure it's just not worth considering 18:25:59 Yep, they are implementing it right now, we are currently waiting to see what the speed benefits are 18:26:38 They gave rough numbers in a live stream on youtube, but I think most are holding out for concrete numbers 18:27:03 yeah, would be foolish to base expectations on a dev prototype 18:27:52 Numbers can be seen here: https://youtu.be/pCSjN9__mtc?t=2110 18:28:34 yeah exactly, hopefully by Q1 we will have better numbers