anyone know anything about solana

as why i should hate it presumably 😂

At least it's not nano

kek

lel

but like, is it legit or just a pamp

written in rust

i heard it's all peeps from that one hw company

who makes cellphones

fack can't member the name

“Cloudbreak, our accounts database, is a mapping of Public Keys to Accounts. Accounts maintain balances and data, where data is a vector of bytes.” It’s like an optimized distributed sql database or something...

qualcom

it's got some "proof of history" algo

fack wrong link

i'm not crypto savvy enough to know if it's legit

like the actual algo

their marketting is indeed to memey

Kinda see what they are doing... seems a bit ambitious to put heuristics so deep in their protocol

At this point, crypto has progressed so much that none of us can understand. Even the developers of one project don't fully understand another project.

We're naturally going to tend towards fud, since we've already chosen our crypto of choice.

I.e. did you know solana went down for 8 hours in december. Like the whole network

no

link?

i'd like to read on that for sure

and thanks

It's on their medium

kk

i'm pretty interested in a chain for signing aggregate trades

so speed is somewhat of a requirement

You mean order matching?

no

i mean order grouping

then submission for matching

not clearing

more like, multi-player, trustless collaborative trades

the clearing system would be market specific

And what's the purpose of that?

lol

does it matter

what is the purpose of trading

to make money

more obviously, many small accounts in aggregate = few large accounts

How would it make money?

trading makes money

sorry i'm not sure i understand if you understand

have you ever traded before?

I came up with aggregate tx protocol for monero called txtangle. Not sure if that’s the same thing

link me

if you're a profitable trader

then that means you make more money then you lose

web.getmonero.org/library/Zero-to-Monero-2-0-0.pdf chapter 11

if you combine traders like this

they have more capital

in aggregate

It’s prob not that efficient though

sweet thx

let me read and i'll poke you with questions if that's cool

The solana protocol looks a bit interesting, though it sounds like they have gated node participation

Sure thing :)

if you dig into it please do share insights

Stellar’s federated Byzantine agreement model is more interesting because it allows any node to participate. I could be misunderstanding Solana tho..

because a lot of it is a bit over my head

i didn't do much cryptography in edu

i haven't read stellar's design at all

Consensus protocols are not crypto for the most part - only transaction protocols use a lot of crypto

sure true

still it's a lot of the crypto parlance and i think presumed knowledge

consensus stuff is definitely more familiar

though BFT i still haven't gone fully through

I wouldn’t advise trying to understand stellar white paper it is headache inducing

kk

read code then?

hm well I have a paper on it coming out sometime in near future... best hope I guess

oh really

nice then will definitely read it

<UkoeHB "hm well I have a paper on it com"> Do you just do this for fun?

well federated Byzantine agreement is pretty fun, but the deeper stellar protocol is tough

lol

well ztm was for fun, I am getting paid for the new paper

lol

the rabbit hole: github.com/stellar/stellar-core/tree/master/src/scp

chapter 10 will be on stellar consensus protocol, because MobileCoin uses their own implementation of it github.com/UkoeHB/Mechanics-of-MobileCoin

do you work on monero core?

For stellar implementation this one may be easiest to study github.com/bobg/scp

no I just like monero :)

just when i think i'm reducing web tabs 😂

haha well idk if it’s worth going down the rabbit hole, I just thought the difference between solana and stellar is interesting

it's always worth it

cmon

those shrooms fueled trail runs ain't gonna do themselves

UkoeHB: tried to dm you, not sure it works over the bridge

no presh

did not get it; my account is on +R due to spam so may not be getting pms..

ok turned it off if u want to try again

it's weird it's already showing me in a room

i think the bridge might not handle it well

i should just get ma old irc hooked up through this

I got your msg

nice

Do you think that you are too intelligent to be in a cult? Then I would encourage you to look into how any other cult works. They aren't populated by stupid people. Aum Shinrikyo was almost exclusively university professors and graduates. For Pete's sake - they had the know-how and means to make WMDs.

As to Monero, I would encourage you to look at Jonestown mass-suicide. You know why Jones killed them all? Because he was afraid he is loosing control over them. People like that will burn everything around them rather than give up control. Being smart doesn't make you immune to being in a cult. This is the most valuable lesson Monero taught me.

apotheon: sadly I lost all my watches in a terrible boating accident

> Being smart doesn't make you immune to being in a cult. This is the most valuable lesson Monero taught me.

lets get culty

whats the maintained monero ebuild in gentoo?

how do i install monero from portage (the package manger?)

cryptopsy: wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:GURU

gentoo? Don't you guys build everything from source?

they pretend to

but really it's the pain of burning time they all like

But we do

you kinda do

emerge or wtv right?

"building from source" to me is a `git clone` -> do the manual steps

it's like an automated bdsm pkg mngr

which like i get

gotta get that fix somehow

you can literally do all the same shit as every other distro

except you don't get shipped binaries

It's just autism

i gotta say it's super endearing

lel

only peeps i like getting grumped at by more are emacs-ers

emacs is life

If only one of you gave Papa ChooChoo some TLC when I wrote a faster miner, instead of ignoring him, things could have happened differently np.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/5lsfgt/_/dbz0jnp

lord_fomo[m]: gentoo is more about freedom of choice vs actually making things from source, which is just a by-product that makes things easier

people get the wrong idea because they think Gentoo is supposed to be minimalistic

But why not arch

well, if i need to use an older version of boost for compatibility with an old binary

i can do that on gentoo

Where you get the hipster dufus label for free

it just makes really niche stuff easier

<vekin "i can do that on gentoo"> You can do that anywhere though

"easier" being the key point

That's not a tina distro

Fair

I guess these days people just lob that stuff into containers

yeah its getting to that point

probably cleaner to do it that way

security nightmare though

So then the Gentoo sell points are kinda, dated

It's just a time burn

i mean, being able to grab andy rando .patch and apply it to packages just by dropping it into a directory is nice

<vekin "security nightmare though"> Everything is

Always

emoji support in libxft.... font-width hacks in urxvt

Heh

Fair

you can do that on Arch but its with AUR packages from god knows where

that may break at any time

I'm using alacritty now

It's aight

what's alacritty?

<vekin "you can do that on Arch but its "> Yeah gotta dig into pkgbuild

<vekin "what's alacritty?"> Term emu

ah rust/opengl tty

In rust

It works

And has a nice pager

gonna check it out

I'm hooked

Upgraded from termite

sech1: is xmrig supposed to send keepalives when --keepalive is set, or when --keepalive is set and the pool sends a "keepalive" string in an "extensions" array ?

I've been looking at pool and xmrig since a few days ago, and it seems to do the latter, but jtgrassie implies it used to do the former.

So is this a bug that it started requiring the pool string ?

it sends pings to the pool

(I think you're the right person to ask since you're listed as an author, let me know if that's not right)

It does indeed. My question is, s xmrig supposed to send keepalives when --keepalive is set, or when --keepalive is set and the pool sends a "keepalive" string in an "extensions" array ?

It did not send them when I set --keepalive and using jtgrassie's pool, and I debugged it to that extensins array. Patching the pool to add that string fixed it.

Now, that extensions array was introduced by a commit dealing with nicehash, so possibly it's a bug it started requiring it for other pools ?

I never touched that part of code, but it looks like it only sends keepalives if the pool has this extension

So you don't know if it's intended ? jtgrassie implies it used to not be that way in jtgrassie/monero-pool #74

I think both the pool needs to support it and it must be in xmrig's command line

That's the current code, yes.

I never ever had to use --keepalive

fluffypony: Maybe losing all your watches was a good thing. If you had too many, it seems like you may have already been drowning in them.

not sure where it's even required

It's required if the pool is aggressive cutting off silent miners. jtgrassie's pool defaults to 150 seconds, that's how I saw this.

moneromooo it was a part of refactoring between xmrig 2.14 and 2.15 in May 2019, this is when "keepalive" extension check was added

before that keepalive was assumed available for all pools except nicehash and minergate :D

So... bug ?

feature

OK. Thanks for looking.

I guess it's a moot point but I'd be interested in why it became a requirement for the pool to report support.

is monero the only crypto currency that is both privacy focused and asic resistant?

Also, is the set of extensions documented somewhere ? I've seen a few in the source, and algo/connect look like they might be interesting to know about.

It's not properly documented anywhere, stratum for Monero is ad-hoc standard

Depends how you define "only" :) There are small forks at least.

So these extensions are somehting xmrig made up basically ?

I think MoneroOcean made them up :D

Hrm. Another source to read :S

it had "algo" extension in the beginning to tell xmrig which algorithm to mine

Ah, it's the one that switches, right. Makes sense.

looks like neither MO or nodejs-pool send the keepalive "extension"

does xmrfast.com have a long pplns window duration like more than a day?

Try asking in #monero-pools

That moment when discord flagges me for suspicious activities

been banned 2x

already

fuck those charlys

if Discord flags you, you create a new account. Do not give them your phone number.

the best choice is to stop using Discord anyway

up

* yup

SomeHacker: I don't disagree with that.

they're just an evil coorp

sold out to wallstreet

and mine their users

perfect for tinas

apotheon: too true

What do you mean by "tinas"?

fluffypony: Yeah, it's something to "watch out" for.

thatcher speak

touche

lol

closed minded naive types

"normies"

"npcs"

lord_fomo[m]: not familiar with "thatcher speak", I guess

Is this related to Margaret?

"unfettered liberalists"

. . . or people who thatch?

she started it yah

it's trader slang

tinas buy when stocks are up

I see.

sell when they're down

and run OS's like windows and OS X

"Bitcoin was going up, so I bought some, but I got ripped off! It dropped right afterward! I had to sell it all!"

have never used ssh

everyone's a tina is some way tho

i'm a cryptography tina

Even Windows has SSH built in now.

ok, then tor

idk why do they use Discord when there is IRC

they say features, but feature creep is not good

discord is trash

there's zero reason

I think most Windows and MacOS users don't use SSH, though, even when it's included.

it's pure web trash

SomeHacker: People aren't aware that feature creep isn't good.

Many people still think "more features" is "better", just like "more lines of code" is "more productivity".

but isn't it obvious? Sometimes my browser abuses my CPU to 100% because of features

lord_fomo[m]: If you want to use a closed source, privacy-hostile chat system, Discord has one advantage: it's a little less user-hostile than Slack, in my experience.

tina is a nice term too because it's non-offensive

so I try to use web less

slack is worse trash

What's the etymology of "tina"?

if you have to use slack checkout ripcord

fortunately never happened to use Slack

for a native client

makes it tolerable

I had to deal with Slack at a previous employer.

i have to for "data scientists"

matrix will take i think in the future

it's a good design

Everything is bad

IRC is good

anti-fragile

matrix is good

No need to replace

it adds a lot vs. irc that was needed imo

and who cares

they bridge

i'm surprised more monero peeps aren't pro matrix honestly

their e2ee system is pretty top notch

and they've got p2p coming on the protocol soon

also, while I'm pro-IRC, I don't like freenode at all. It is an evil attempt to centralize IRC

still in early stages iirc

> Firefox in not-private-browsing mode

wtf

I don't like running anything in my browser, I see that both Firefox and Chrome are proprietary shit (I know, but Firefox has DRM and Mozilla things, like their spying VPN gateway).

even attempts to fix Firefox like IceCat and Tor Browser still have feature creep. HTML5 is overfeatured and JS just shouldn't exist

a browser is not a virtual machine to run programs in it

it is a tool to read pages

lol

don't get me started

but clearly we should be friends

imo the web is all pure trash

like, pretty much all of it

At the point where Firefox stopped supporting modularity for the rendering engine, its downhill run on quality accelerated rapidly.

. . . then it swapped out rendering engines so it could be more restrictively crappy, copying Chrome.

Now they are pushing IRCv3 trash to freenode

is plain chromium actually better privacy wise then ff?

there are *enough* features in IRC. Just stop and use it

that's what i been reading

lord_fomo[m]: only if further stripped of privacy-violating crap in a third-party build

otherwise, it's about the same, probably

Choosing less evil spyware? Google is more evil I think.

(which is to say: mediocre)

kk

i do need to get off ff proper

they are both evil. There are attempts to fix it, but W3C has been killed by evil capitalism, and the web is dead. Try Lynx maybe

hmm

but tbh I think the issues started when the Internet became widespread. Too many people who don't want to learn, and use things because they are "convenient".

yeah it's interesting

the selling of freedom for convenience

odd tradeoff

For general web use, I figure it's best to just pick a WebKit browser that doesn't offend you too much, these days. In some cases, something like w3m works fine, though, if you want a TUI browser.

lol no thanks

eventually i'll get to the point where i'll only use it for simple pages

but aways from that yet

I have Firefox for the instances where I need it, but I try to avoid that.

lynx ow?

"ow"

What?

I prefer w3m over lynx.

anyway

. . . gotta run

ta

other wise

I recommend using Gemini over HTTP, to avoid W3C issues

W3C can't be trusted anymore

yah need to dig into that as well

oh hey apotheon, did you ever get monero built?

<SomeHacker "the best choice is to stop using"> I wish, but the trolling must continue

i completely forgot about this, but if you hit the boost storage_type error you just need to remove the -march=native flag. `cmake -DARCH=default .` in the build directory, then `gmake` again

note: in the build/.../release directory, not in the source dir!

btw what y'all think of rust these days

given i presume most are in c++

round these parts

Has anyone looked into whether monero could be added to trustwallet?

ndorf: I was going to do it yesterday, but other stuff got in the way. Today's pretty busy, so probably this weekend.

lord_fomo[m]: I'd probably learn Rust over going back to C++ at this point.

I do write C, though.

you ever look at zig?

What you say...

rupee[m]: They actually worked on integrating, but then closed the PR due to insufficient dev power

thanks dEBRUYNE . That's too bad. I'd happily contribute to a CCS to get it done if we could find a developer that would work on it

moneromooo: nice

moneromooo: I like semi-obscure references made obscure by the reference.

I wonder whether Zig (the programming language) was named after that.

i don't know this

I can tell you why you can't stop the 'spam'. You are thinking in cult doctrine. If it was real spam, and I was selling Viagra for example - you could easily ban keywords and urls. Instead, stop being a sheep, think like a cult leader. Recoginse that this 'spam' is just some bullshit that you tell to the sheep.

When you do that, solution will present itself. Observe. 'spam' -> 'FUK talks bad things about Monero on our IRC' (Don't say that out loud obviously, that will get you excommunicated) Solution? Get off-the-shelf sentiment analyser, detect anyone who 'talks bad things about Monero' and ban them.

i gotta say

this room has some strange commentary

needs more chill

since when has anyone been banned for "talking bad things about monero"?

See I can say a bad thing about monero: it needs better tor/i2p integration (which is hopefully being worked on)

/kb Elementoshi[m]

i don't think i'm going to get banned for saying that

Just wait till I work out how to use that command...

here's some more bad things it's used to buy drugs, its value is volatile, and it's not a 100% bulletproof solution

here's a really bad thing: some jerk is ruining the community with spam

It's a common thing jerks say to save face. They're obviously not kicked for being massive asswipes, but because we refuse to see their obvious truth.

So... *shrug*

lol

can you remind me what kind of asswipery they were doing?

No. I like my life free of this ^_^

lol

I hope everyone gets on the Monero clubhouse tomorrow

Why?

How does one even "get on" a clubhouse?

20:58 < Elementoshi[m]> See I can say a bad thing about monero: it needs better tor/i2p integration (which is hopefully being worked on)

I think Tor needs better I2P integration.

20:59 < Elementoshi[m]> here's a really bad thing: some jerk is ruining the community with spam

I disagree. The jerk is barely noticeable, really.