Hi all

Why does the Saviour of NASA take a group achievement award and present it as a proof of individual glory? twitter.com/hyc_symas/status/1203709575226183683

john_r365: also one of the bigger potential privacy improvements come from signature aggregation, which is kind of like ring signatures, which will help in coinjoin/payjoin scenarios I believe - HOWEVER, that didn't make the cut for the taproot implementation, so unknown when/if it gets implemented. And amounts are still clear on BTC... and will likely be so forever. also keep in mind that many financial

investors in BTC see the visibility on-chain as a big plus, and are vehemently opposed to privacy enhancements that would make their investment more shady by adding privacy. And a small side note: taproot would also make atomic swaps with e.g. XMR be indistinguishable from a regular taproot tx.

Confirmation that xmr.is is legit?

AFAIK it's fairly new.

Can't confirm, never used it

But an instant exchange with no KYC means 99% you'll get tainted BTC

good. the sooner >50% of wallets are marked as 'tainted', the better

hi

<mmxxx[m] "xmr.is"> Seems untrustworthy. How are the decentralized?

they

they aren't same as xmr.to wasn't

Xmr.to didn't claim that they "use decentralized exchange protocol to manage transactions"

Inge - thanks for the reply. So in effect if/when signature aggregation gets implemented, you'll be able to do large coinswaps at lower transaction sizes, and "within" P2TR transactions, such that they're multisig - but you can't tell from the blockchain that they're multisig?

john_r365: yeah I think so.

I just read the chat logs re: NFT discussion

NFTs are simply bubbles, right? Everyone knows that they have no inherent worth and never will, and are simply pumping and dumping the "assets"?

s/are/is s/bubbles/a bubble

basicly yes. it's just cryptokitties reloaded

and if the cryptokitty site goes away, so do the kitties vanish

so it's basically hype to create the impression that people want that NFT

and every NFT seller has to shill their own NFT

Isn't this good for the cryptocurrency economy as a whole? Shills would migrate to using NFT to make easy money instead of shilling shitcoins

I think it's bad, because it promotes the narrative that crypto-stuff is all a dumpster fire to the average joe who has no idea of the technical difference between "real" crypto and NFTs and tokens and stuff

They see all this money thrown around on useless garbage and it just reinforces their prejudice

And we've all seen just how problematic people with strong prejudices and unfounded ideas can be in the last year

let them. i don't see a problem

lets keep real. if they don't understand cryptocurrencies after 12 years of its existance, how will they understand NFTs? if they see it as a get rich quick scheme there's no hope

but it is a get rich quick scheme

aside from DRM there is no sensible use-case for NFTs

Items in a game.

(by DRM I also refer to the entire class of goods that can have a unique ID which can then be used as part of an NFT instead of tracking the ownership of the physical good itself)

yeah, that too

afaik it works great for a ticketing system

There is a sensible use case for NFTs

You're only seeing how they're being used right now and imagining use cases from that.

For example: I want to sell ownership in my company. I want everyone to make sure that their part of the ownership can never be diluted by more share creation. I want the share ownership to be freely transferable.

Boom... use case for NFTs

Rings a bell ^_^

:)

Probably a token with the amount of shares you want to issue would be better though.. Then you'd be able to sell partial shares.

But if you didn't want people to be able to sell partial shares.

The reason for that might be that you want to pay dividends.

what if you sell the NFT and don't deliver the shares?

The NFTs ARE the shares.

NFTs aren't legally accepted as a representation of ownership though

I feel like I am missing something

dude... you're trying to get away from all of that regulation and need for middlemen

Stop conforming to the systems the bankers have made you a slave to.

huh

listen to the man

Well, assuming that the party that creates and sells the NFTs is honest, then yes, NFTs are a strong case for what you describe

DYODD

Do Your Own Due Diligence

aye. Just a heads up: NFTs don't prevent double-spending: I could create 20 NFTs that correspond to 10% of my onion service startup and sit back and watch the fireworks after they are sold

the only places this idea will work out is where legal organizations cannot exist

I'm not understanding what you're saying.

Well, here's the scenario: I create 20 non-fungible tokens, each supposedly equivalent to owning 10% of shares of my sparkling new onion service startup

ok

I manage to sell >10 of them, say all 20

So you sold your whole company?

Twice over.

even if I did do that, I sold 200% of my company's worth

yes, which means the buyers are now in trouble

This is where the DYODD comes in.

yep, I agree with you there

I still don't see a problem.

Well, it all depends on the reputation of the person creating the NFTs. Isn't there no point of NFTs then? Why not simply rely on the words of the owner of the company?

Which gambling site sold shares via investment in BTC and they payout a dividend to the BTC address all the time?

I forget which... but it happened.

well, I am sure someone will succeed with the investment model you propose

Will you HODL XMR or dump it for Tari when it comes out? Will others?

Tari is never coming out man... give it up.

oh man I wish I could have an extended conversation with the troll. they always seem like they know some deep dark secret of monero, and in the end they rarely provide sources or write up something exstensive

What's tari?

Some NFT stuff

lol

does it do contracts too?

Everyting is NFT if it's not fungible

Does emojis!

therefore only Monero is not NFT

i always forget if its NFT or smart contracts

LOTS of emojis

<tvgdzrhbknuv> lazy today, only 1 channel spammed?

<mmxxx[m] "Confirmation that xmr.is is legi"> a friend used it and it worked

test.

test failed

rip...

rip failed

tfw

Tfw failed in life lole

lole

lole

any way I can be added with perms to be able to open PRs? github.com/monero-project/monero/co…amsungGalaxyPlayer:patch-2?expand=1

You look like a bot sgp_[m]1

:P

beep boop

that's what a bot would say

more censorship in surveillance coin land: finance.yahoo.com/news/marathon-dig…oldings-launch-first-200000064.html

believes this infrastructure will help further decentralize Bitcoin

oh

ok

Holy shit.

Bitcoin is now no different than any other strategic or rare earth commodity

chyna bad

murica good

I thought it was supposed to be KYC-compliant by ensuring only miners who provide all their info would be allowed.

. . . but it's supposedly only going to process transactions on the blockchain that are KYC-complaint.

s/complaint/compliant/

That's downright nutso.

their using DMG's tech (aka Blockseer), which has been doing this for a number of months, possibly still in beta.

s/their/they're

Now the regulators can start going around to other pools and saying, we know you can do this. DO THIS!

fucking hell

DMG ? Oh my, it all makes sense now... It's just a massive anti privacy conspiracy then...

So... if these people really are the ones trying to short monero into the ground *and* going full panopticon, then bitcoin people really have to try and short squeeze the bastards to win :D

(if there are bitcoin people left)

i don't buy that people are short monero

from Oct: finance.yahoo.com/news/dmg-subsidia…eer-launches-bitcoin-130000157.html

Could be exchange lying, true.

I mean, on bitfinex, there are more shorts than longs, which is unusual among the coins on bitfinex. But the total amount short isn't very much. And I think there is very little OTC lending going on.

What is a good recommended pool to start mining at for a newbie with a single computer?

i started with supportxmr

Thanks. I will take a look at supportxmr

Is that one of the two big ones ?

It is. Better to use another then, to avoid compromising network health further.

good point

I think this is yet again a "do something about it" moment. I'll do something about it.

Will you HODL XMR or dump it for Tari when it comes out? Will others?

datamish.com/xmrusd/14d according to this site looks xmr is the only coin of their listings that is more shorted than longed

yes, that's what I was referring to. It's just one exchange, and the total amount shorted isn't very much in the grand scheme of things.

I'd think I would hear more rumors about people looking for borrows if there were some big fish trying to short it in size.

of course I could be wrong, and certainly seems like most people hold the opposite view. I'd be really interested in any evidence other than bitfinex that there are large shorts in the market.

shouldn't the binance futures be trading at a discount to spot if someone was massively shorting XMR?

hello

my family has a small farm in new england, and they've decided to accept monero and btc

very cool

i'm considering whether i should set them up to use the monero gui and all that, or if a payment gateway would be better

do y'all have any advice?

rupee[m]: yeah :-) i'm super excited about it

moneromooo: What will you do about it?

u9000: That depends on enough variables that I'm not sure how to answer it.

I'm not the expert, though, so maybe I wouldn't have the best advice anyway.

what are some of the variables?

Do they have a direct use for XMR? Are they likely to want to hold for potential value increase, treating it as savings, or should they just get it immediately turned into USD? What kinds of transactions are they likely to make with XMR? How comfortable are they with the technology? Are they already using some payment gateway -- and, if so, is it something that would integrate well with a

gateway that supports XMR? Are you going to do some of the work of regular handling of stuff for them? Will you use some kind of automation for invoicing, or product labelling, or something like that -- and will there be some kind of special hardware for all that?

many, many variables

If you're including Monero and BTC, though, I might also consider BCH.

that's useful insight

thank you

sure

glad to help

u9000, what kind of payment gateway? I'd personally accept payments directly.

(whole point of p2p ecash I'd imagine)

apotheon: a dumb "get me a random pool" URL, with weights inversely proportional to hash rate.

You never know, it might work a bit.

as2333: the kind where the end user doesn't have to deal with multiple coins

i'd also accept payments directly, but i know what a wallet is

moneromooo: nice

presumably from a selected set

Yes. No scraping. For now anyway.

Scraping might be . . . unwise? It could result in directing people to shitty pools that nobody should join.

At least, I think so.

again, not the expert

moneromooo: Which are the "big two"?

Obviously, supportxmr and one more . . .

here's a list of pools: miningpoolstats.stream/monero

minexmr has been #1 for a while now

with around 1/3 the HR

gotcha

I see that on the chart.

rupee[m]: thanks

my pool is in the 20s

Cryptonote?

well not "my" pool

<moneromooo "apotheon: a dumb "get me a rando"> cool. how do you tell the hashrates of the various minepools?

apparently that chart rupee[m] shared

it's live and up to date

I mine on pool.xmr.pt they have been around long time and are commited to monero

originally set up for the Portuguese community but luckily they accept dumb muricans like me

nioc: sweet

I took the data off revuo-monero.com/issue-96.html, doens't matter if it's really accurate.

Now, maybe suggesting really small pools is not so great, I'm not sure.

middling pools, perhaps

Anyway, feel free to link there when someone asks next.

size bell curve for randomization weighting

moneromooo: Maybe you can get that into the topic of #monero-pools.

I'll leave that to those people's discretion.

moneromooo: well minergate and viabtc are on that revuo link of yours so no I would not go with that info

link = revuo

viabtc is a scam one ? I omitted minergate already.

hmm, requires client-side scripting

Most do AFAIK.

le sad

Oh, my page ? Yes.

I am unsure / unclear about via

Otherwise it'd be PHP and ain't nobody got time for PHP...

But feel free to make one that does it :D

What about a simple C program via CGI?

Oh yes!

Damn. 20 year flashback :D

I'd rather write that than a PHP thing.

When you write object oriented PHP, you get PHP Object Oriented Hypertext Preprocessor, or POOHP.

lol, I called it choose_pool.bat for kicks and owasp rules block it :D

oy

moneromooo: What about SSI?

I have no clue what SSI means.

single sign in?

Thanks, much better without JS requirement :)

Secret Service Intruder ?

Schutzstaffelinspektor

Now that sounds like something I don't want in my future...

2l8t

dang redundant t